Sociopath Community

Virus stated: source post

Turncoat stated: source post

Virus stated: source post

I guess it's all in what is meant by the man of the house... I would say there is a lack on Men of the Houses and in part what is crippling our society and provoking much of the problems we see in gender identify issues...

That largely depends on how progressive where they live is and if something like divorce is largely why the male presence is absent. 

Gender identity issues I'd personally say is the byproduct of societal expectation, and with things like the internet they finally have a platform to make themselves be more known, feel less alone. If there weren't so many expectations made on both genders, they could instead be themselves without stigma. I'd say that the problems have been around as long as things like homosexuality has.

I think we are very close to saying the same thing...

Are... we? 
 

where we seem to differ is whether those expectations were/are good or not...

They aren't, they're quite oppressive. It's using commonality through social constructs and what few areas actually differ like testosterone levels to try to blanket how everyone should be. 
 

and can those expectations still work in this modern society?

It can as long as it's self-imposed as opposed to expected, and ideally as long as it's not doing any harm to themselves, is actually who they are instead of who they were made to be. A man should be allowed to be a man just as much as anyone else can be themselves.

Being yourself's thankfully spreading more and more with each coming generation. I for one welcome this sort of progression, as long as it's not people professing how they're actually animals born in human form or psy-vampires. As freedom to be as you are instead of how society expects you to be spreads, we'll likely see more gray area surface from the lack of expectations molding people into uniform traits. 
 

I noticed your stance referred pretty much directly to Sys... and his circumstances,,, I think the above will as well...

It's... so much more than that though. His past is pretty rough, and has paved the way for some issues he's still contending with. 

As much as I am prone to questioning how natural aspects of the gender binary are, his case specifically for me is closer to concern. 

This opens the possibility you are too close for proper perspective or perception... I know you two are close... so... I really don't see where tearing down his core values, lessening them by inferring a negative tone to his core value such as "sad" is friendly... my take...

Discussing Syst and discussing gender expectations, while interrelated, is really discussing two topics at once. While the expectations are harmful as a whole, in his case it's all the other baggage that's connected to it that makes for a unique expression. 

Again, "core value" to him means "need", and I know he can take this sort of talking both from past discussions with him and through how open he allows himself to be on this forum. They are inherently negative, and the costs attached in his case hurt him. 
 

 

Men need to be smart men, strong men, men of accountability... and take care of what they are responsible for... that doesn't mean not asking for help from a woman or partner... that would be a dumb man.

"Men" don't need to do that, "People" do. 

Of course... and Black Lives Matter, I mean All Lives Matter... fuck that.. there ARE differences that make us who we are and gender is one of them... different does not mean better, just different...

I never figured you to be this sexist. Not meaning it as a point of offense, but maybe it has to do with your age? 
 

you bring your beauty to the table as who you are...

Did you just say I was beautiful? 
 

this modern society has "people" upside down to the point they can live like a 4 year old, or a dog, or friggin coffee pot if they want to and should you speak about it you are a judgmental racist, animal hating, coffee pot smashing, bigot! 

Age Play, Otherkin, and... err... breakfast roleplay(?) are a bit different than what we're discussing. I'm not even going into gender bending surgery, but instead about embracing who you are as you are as opposed to feeling pressured to appear within a series of expectations. As long as it's causing no harm, we should be able to be ourselves. 
 

Men need to be men... if you say society throws stigmas on that, not my problem... Men still need to be... A Man.  No excuses...

No, they can be whatever is natural for them, whatever works, whatever invites success into their lives. I can be "the woman" (the bottom) in a relationship with the only real problem following being some weird looks from time to time from people who carry outdated sexist values. 

Everyone should aim to be strong, and their strengths ought to reflect who they are as opposed to what parts are downstairs. 

Virus stated: source post

this modern society has "people" upside down to the point they can live like a 4 year old, or a dog, or friggin coffee pot if they want to and should you speak about it you are a judgmental racist, animal hating, coffee pot smashing, bigot! 

That's a very dramatic hyperbole. Have you met many people living as coffee pots?

When I see this argument, it reeks of "fear of change", fear of where you might fit into a society that allowed people to live as they please. What does it matter to you if someone wants to wear a dress and call themselves Samantha? How does that impact your life?

Of course, you ought to be able to voice a critical opinion. But... you are voicing a critical opinion... And no one is calling you a bigot?

What's more, your right to voice an opinion is equal to that of another. You say nigger, they say racist. That's two opinions being voiced. Where's the problem?

yes, but the result of people just being themselves, would still create a clear difference in some characteristics between the different genders.

because its only natural.
and from this natural behavior is where the stereotypes and societal pressure came from. its also why its weird to not act by them... its out of the ordinary.

http://www.canberratimes.com.au/act-news/act-parliament-passes-religious-vilification-laws-20160804-gqlagu.html

"Thursday's changes to the Discrimination Act also added disability to the list, so it is now illegal to vilify someone because of disability, religion, race, sexuality, gender identity, and HIV/AIDS status. Vilification can include social media posts, actions in a workplace and wearing clothes, signs or flags that would incite hatred, contempt, ridicule or revulsion."

step by step, we march to the flames

ThenFuckit stated: source post

yes, but the result of people just being themselves, would still create a clear difference in some characteristics between the different genders.

because its only natural.
and from this natural behavior is where the stereotypes and societal pressure came from. its also why its weird to not act by them... its out of the ordinary.

I suppose we'll see how much this is the case in the next few decades. I think a lot of it's blown out of proportion from peer modeling, much like what can have a boy stop playing with dolls once they start going to school, or influence girls to wear makeup once they grow older. 

Gray area expressions will be interesting as technology continues to build a bridge between the diverse expressions that are normally cut away by peer pressure's shears. Where we are now, people tend to "find themselves" once they hit college or conventions from how much everything before those points didn't let them do it prior. 

The expectations that are in place may be there from genetic predispositions, but as other behaviors become gradually less outcasted we'll likely see different measures of things like testosterone play out. As more feminine men and masculine women find themselves more capable of breeding, who knows what might become the new norm. 

I'm actually not in favour of those laws. I don't think we ought to legislate on subjectivity.

However, you didn't actually respond to the content of my above post. This is a rather separate issue.

I'll anticipate your response to that ^... Might be something like "these laws exist because people want to live as special snowflakes".

That's a very weak causal link. I think these particular laws have more to do with the relationship between Islam and modern Australian society. 

What would you say to a society where people are free to live as they please within the law, and also free to criticise whatever they wish?

ImNotHer stated: source post

Women: Do you remember the first time you were told that guys will only want you for one thing, then told you should wait to give your virginity to someone who loves you?

Actually my parents' only statements to this were retarded dirty jokes followed by a try to make me tell him nothing happened so he can sleep at night (my dad) and a "LOL who'd want to get too close to you anyways the way you run around you're pretty much safe" followed by telling me to be home at 10 so "no one will kidnap or rape you nervous laugh "  (my mom), also as a kid I had just one female friend and she was a whore. the guys I was friends with until I was 14 or so didn't tell me how to live my life lol

What about those of you who were not socialized the way most parents do their children... or, maybe you were but still didn't turn out to fit into typical stereotypes?

I never got along with the girls my age. I just didnt care about teenage girl problems as much or would talk about which twilight retard is hotter or whatever the fuck else with them. I got along well with the boys until I was about 13, maybe 14, when they started getting super awkward around me because I was a girl talking to them and they obviously read the wrong shit on the internet and thought I'd like them more than the other friends. Long story short, they didnt talk to me anymore about everything like before, I told them they're childish and I'd like them to fuck off.

But until that point I spent my life on climbing trees, swearing, sports and whatever else boys that age would do in a group of four to ten. Result: Today I'm lazy af and in love with food and my bed, but I still swear a lot, tell people what I think and never watched Titanic. I started reading a lot out of boredom back then - actually I always did that, just even more at that time, so I became the one kid in class that could wear a shirt saying "human wikipedia" that's always ignored by teachers. Didn't exactly make people like me, but I didn't care.

Turncoat stated: source post

 

ThenFuckit stated: source post

yes, but the result of people just being themselves, would still create a clear difference in some characteristics between the different genders.

because its only natural.
and from this natural behavior is where the stereotypes and societal pressure came from. its also why its weird to not act by them... its out of the ordinary.

I suppose we'll see how much this is the case in the next few decades. I think a lot of it's blown out of proportion from peer modeling, much like what can have a boy stop playing with dolls once they start going to school, or influence girls to wear makeup once they grow older. 

Gray area expressions will be interesting as technology continues to build a bridge between the diverse expressions that are normally cut away by peer pressure's shears. Where we are now, people tend to "find themselves" once they hit college or conventions from how much everything before those points didn't let them do it prior. 

The expectations that are in place may be there from genetic predispositions, but as other behaviors become gradually less outcasted we'll likely see different measures of things like testosterone play out. As more feminine men and masculine women find themselves more capable of breeding, who knows what might become the new norm. 

Now some of the most privileged people seem to be unable to find themselves and do not know what to do and fail to take responsibility for themselves. There are no stupid rules imposed on them, no real peer pressure and there is comfort for them everywhere. You would think a person should thrive in such an environment? But they lack discipline and from this they lack vision and responsibility. They are afraid to form their own identity and own it and they do not have any idea what to do with their lives. But they are self entitled at the same time... So they join some group, to feel accepted, to have a purpose and have no personal responsibility and to feel safe in a group. And from there, they will do anything to validate themselves, irrelevant if their actions are reasonable, or if their goals are reasonable, or whatever.

People need order to function efficiently. And the best order is a standard to follow. Only those that truly know themselves can break the standard against the odds, the rest are nothing but lost souls. Peer pressure should exist, but to an extend, while laws must be objective. Peer pressure is the obstacle you should be able to pass, if you truly believe in yourself and who you are. And you do not live alone on this planet, other people have sensibilities too, you should respect them(to a reasonable extend). A 'standard to follow' is the general sensibility people have: its the most efficient.

haart stated: source post

I'm actually not in favour of those laws. I don't think we ought to legislate on subjectivity.

However, you didn't actually respond to the content of my above post. This is a rather separate issue.

I'll anticipate your response to that ^... Might be something like "these laws exist because people want to live as special snowflakes".

That's a very weak causal link. I think these particular laws have more to do with the relationship between Islam and modern Australian society. 

What would you say to a society where people are free to live as they please within the law, and also free to criticise whatever they wish?

You mean the society that already existed? Before 'the change'? Only barrier left was religion. Now we have another barrier that protects religion instead.

"You mean the society that already existed? Before 'the change'? Only barrier left was religion. Now we have another barrier that protects religion instead."

Ah... My original post was actually referencing gender roles and gender identity.

I think we may have overlapping opinions about religion.

Turncoat stated: source post

 

Virus stated: source post

Turncoat stated: source post

Virus stated: source post

I guess it's all in what is meant by the man of the house... I would say there is a lack on Men of the Houses and in part what is crippling our society and provoking much of the problems we see in gender identify issues...

That largely depends on how progressive where they live is and if something like divorce is largely why the male presence is absent. 

Gender identity issues I'd personally say is the byproduct of societal expectation, and with things like the internet they finally have a platform to make themselves be more known, feel less alone. If there weren't so many expectations made on both genders, they could instead be themselves without stigma. I'd say that the problems have been around as long as things like homosexuality has.

I think we are very close to saying the same thing...

Are... we? 

Yes... I am sure... wish this conversation was happening in person... so much easier
 

where we seem to differ is whether those expectations were/are good or not...

They aren't, they're quite oppressive. It's using commonality through social constructs and what few areas actually differ like testosterone levels to try to blanket how everyone should be. 

Whoa... but you says this...
 

and can those expectations still work in this modern society?

It can as long as it's self-imposed

That is exactly what I am suggesting... why did men stop being men?  And I don't care if the image is Carey Grant, John Wayne, Sir Lancelot, or Magnum PI, or Jesus... they all took care of business and were respectful to man, woman, and child...

as opposed to expected, and ideally as long as it's not doing any harm to themselves, is actually who they are instead of who they were made to be. A man should be allowed to be a man just as much as anyone else can be themselves.

Yeah... we are saying the same things...

Being yourself's thankfully spreading more and more with each coming generation. I for one welcome this sort of progression, as long as it's not people professing how they're actually animals born in human form or psy-vampires. As freedom to be as you are instead of how society expects you to be spreads, we'll likely see more gray area surface from the lack of expectations molding people into uniform traits. 

Slippery fucking slope...
 

I noticed your stance referred pretty much directly to Sys... and his circumstances,,, I think the above will as well...

It's... so much more than that though. His past is pretty rough, and has paved the way for some issues he's still contending with. 

As much as I am prone to questioning how natural aspects of the gender binary are, his case specifically for me is closer to concern. 

This opens the possibility you are too close for proper perspective or perception... I know you two are close... so... I really don't see where tearing down his core values, lessening them by inferring a negative tone to his core value such as "sad" is friendly... my take...

Discussing Syst and discussing gender expectations, while interrelated, is really discussing two topics at once. While the expectations are harmful as a whole, in his case it's all the other baggage that's connected to it that makes for a unique expression. 

Again, "core value" to him means "need", and I know he can take this sort of talking both from past discussions with him and through how open he allows himself to be on this forum. They are inherently negative, and the costs attached in his case hurt him. 

And how is allowing him his need when it isn't destructive any different than what was discussed earlier?

Men need to be smart men, strong men, men of accountability... and take care of what they are responsible for... that doesn't mean not asking for help from a woman or partner... that would be a dumb man.

"Men" don't need to do that, "People" do. 

Of course... and Black Lives Matter, I mean All Lives Matter... fuck that.. there ARE differences that make us who we are and gender is one of them... different does not mean better, just different...

I never figured you to be this sexist. Not meaning it as a point of offense, but maybe it has to do with your age? 

More to do with Core values... and not being swayed by public opinion... I admire a strong woman, and truly believe her to be the apex predator... sexist?  Real...

you bring your beauty to the table as who you are...

Did you just say I was beautiful? 

You are... I am thankful I can see it...
 

this modern society has "people" upside down to the point they can live like a 4 year old, or a dog, or friggin coffee pot if they want to and should you speak about it you are a judgmental racist, animal hating, coffee pot smashing, bigot! 

Age Play, Otherkin, and... err... breakfast roleplay(?) are a bit different than what we're discussing. I'm not even going into gender bending surgery, but instead about embracing who you are as you are as opposed to feeling pressured to appear within a series of expectations. As long as it's causing no harm, we should be able to be ourselves. 

Hence, Syst's needs being what they may... you're mother hen-ing a little, no?
 

Men need to be men... if you say society throws stigmas on that, not my problem... Men still need to be... A Man.  No excuses...

No, they can be whatever is natural for them, whatever works, whatever invites success into their lives. I can be "the woman" (the bottom) in a relationship

WHAT?  And I am sexist...

with the only real problem following being some weird looks from time to time from people who carry outdated sexist values. 

Oh... my... Gawd... You can not really care what people think of you if you are a MAN taking care of your responsibilities... we are talking the same thing here, TC... but I think you may have some deep seeded insecurities to deal with in order to live up to being the true "Man of the House"... whatever that may mean.  I am Mom and Dad right now... just to remind you of perspective... and I do get some weird looks... fuck em.

Everyone should aim to be strong, and their strengths ought to reflect who they are as opposed to what parts are downstairs. 

Agreed... no argument at'tall...

Again, you might be too close to properly motivate Syst... just sayin... NOT sayin I can...

@Syst... Be A Man... The Man was Dan Daly!  And I got your back, Brother!