Sociopath Community

Turncoat said: 

Tryptamine said: 

aren't you like the OG nihilist? what happened

Anti-Nihilist. 

No reason to go on other than finding pleasure in life, somehow, and those pleasures are becoming that much more inaccessible. 

because hedonism is a dead-end

in the last few years of my life, i've watched a lot of people who were around me since the beginning die. life can be cheerful amusements (and in a sense it is also crucial that we enjoy our time), but if your True North is dopamine...well, what does that matter when everyone you love will die, and you will die too. i am reminded of a quote some showed me recently

well luckily for this guy, he was a catholic. so it's a happy ending there, in one form or another

i've found it easier to take a true agnostic perspective on reality, and to not think we have all of the answers as advanced monkeys. in the dark case that we are just arrangements of matter, you should also consider that your own emotions are only such in such a circumstance. recognition of circumstances with a frontal cortex, paired with the processing of a temporal lobe. and the pain really comes from when the limbic system protests, out of a genetic programming for survival. in which case, a high priority should be kindness to others. there can be a sort of "kunlangeta treatment" for those who cannot

i am willing to bet that you find joy elusive, because you are within the framework of a sort of meaninglessness (which is why i expressed surprise at what you said). but crucially, this is not a matter of being performative. it is a matter of contending with problems that have no clear solution, where you can never know if you are right. even within that framework, it is important to be agentic. if you watch life happen to you, it does something terrible to your mind

Tryptamine said: 

Hedonism is a dead-end. In the last few years of my life, I've watched a lot of people who were around me since the beginning die. Life can be cheerful amusements (and in a sense it is also crucial that we enjoy our time), but if your True North is dopamine...well, what does that matter when everyone you love will die, and you will die too. 

"every living thing must be sacrificed until the death of death" well luckily for this guy, he was a catholic. so it's a happy ending there, in one form or another

I've found it easier to take a true agnostic perspective on reality, and to not think we have all of the answers as advanced monkeys. in the dark case that we are just arrangements of matter, you should also consider that your own emotions are only such in such a circumstance. recognition of circumstances with a frontal cortex, paired with the processing of a temporal lobe. and the pain really comes from when the limbic system protests, out of a genetic programming for survival. in which case, a high priority should be kindness to others. There can be a sort of "kunlangeta treatment" for those who cannot.

I am willing to bet that you find joy elusive, because you are within the framework of a sort of meaninglessness (which is why i expressed surprise at what you said). but crucially, this is not a matter of being performative. it is a matter of contending with problems that have no clear solution, where you can never know if you are right. even within that framework, it is important to demonstrate agency. If you watch life happen to you, it does something terrible to your mind

Death does not make hedonism a dead end. It only makes pleasure temporary, and everything available to a mortal organism is temporary. A pleasant experience does not become worthless because it ends, just as suffering does not become meaningful because it ends in death. You also move from materialism to kindness without establishing the connection. If emotions are merely neurological processes produced by evolution, that explains why kindness may feel desirable, not why it objectively “should” be a high priority. The same biology also produces cruelty, selfishness, competition, and indifference.

Nor does nihilism necessarily explain why someone finds joy elusive. Meaning and pleasure are separate questions. A person can reject cosmic meaning while still experiencing enjoyment, and a religious person can believe in meaning while remaining miserable. The claim that passivity “does something terrible to your mind” is an unsupported generalization. Being less proactive may have consequences in some situations, but it does not inherently damage the mind or refute nihilism.

The sacrifice quote has the same problem. Sacrifice implies that something is lost for the sake of some larger end, but what end is suffering supposedly advancing toward? Even read charitably, the quote assumes people are sacrificing themselves to consume the world so that “death will die” sooner. But no such purpose has been established. People mostly survive within unequal, dangerous, and hierarchical conditions they did not choose. At most, organisms compete and cooperate while consuming finite resources. That is not a sacrifice toward redemption. It is just life under scarcity and entropy, with a meaning imposed afterward.

"Death does not make hedonism a dead end. It only makes pleasure temporary, and everything available to a mortal organism is temporary. A pleasant experience does not become worthless because it ends, just as suffering does not become meaningful because it ends in death."

not true from the start

things being temporal and without a purpose does indeed make hedonism meaningless. unless "meaning" to you is simply hits of feel-good neurotransmitters. something to think about

Tryptamine said: 

"Death does not make hedonism a dead end. It only makes pleasure temporary, and everything available to a mortal organism is temporary. A pleasant experience does not become worthless because it ends, just as suffering does not become meaningful because it ends in death."

not true from the start

things being temporal and without a purpose does indeed make hedonism meaningless. unless "meaning" to you is simply hits of feel-good neurotransmitters. something to think about

I am affirming that there is no objective meaning. My point is that this doesn't uniquely undermine hedonism. If everything is ultimately without purpose, then every philosophy faces the same condition. Hedonism doesn't become a "dead end" because the universe lacks meaning. It simply values pleasurable experiences within a meaningless universe. You're criticizing it for failing to provide something that I don't think exists in the first place.

Gypsy said: 

Spatial Mind said: 

For the first time in history I gave up on someone I love. 15 years of the same cycles.

Still crosses my mind every single day, but I'm comfortable with my decision. 

I also know what to expect if I let them back in and expose them to my inner circle. 

I did it for peace of mind. Sometimes we have to guard ourselves.  

 When you say you’re giving up on this person, I’m just here wondering why on earth you let her into your life in the first place and carried on with that nonsense for 15 entire years??

Someone I loved for no reason, and as it turned out my capacity to love played out. 

Please don’t say that’s the same woman you originally were talking about on the nabble forum?

I will not say what you know. '-'

Actually I’m not sure it’s any better if that’s a different person. You seem to have no quality control for who you spend your time and energy on and then end up wondering why you’ve got toxic people in your life 

 Now that you mention it, you might be onto something. I've been too nice, but that part of me kinda died. For me toxic cycles are a walk in the park, it's part of what I was forced to become. I had no problem detaching every single time it was time to do so until the return, and this time I decided to be the one to detach first even though I could've easily went another round.

Now there's this energetic block I've created. I did not call her in 14 years, not since I first appeared here in a broken state. It was her calling me the whole time. Now this energetic block is comprised of this statement I'm making. It's silence within silence. I can't tell if it's beautiful or ugly or if it's pleasant or unpleasant. After a year she called and I cut it short, left messages on read. unless, the texts were about me. I don't know that person. 

The spiritual implications of my experience, with the whole loving this person for no reason at all. It's a twin flame connection. A soul contract. I don't know what she learned from me, maybe she's learning something now while getting railed by some other guy. All I know is I'm the one she's hot and cold with, always called, and she' easily has AVPD, so basically her feelings for me scare her while her nervous system's defenses for danger ha her in a state of confusion. I don't feel as much as before. The battle between my heart and brain was epic, the heart fought well but my brain finally won. What's next will either be more of that, but different, something new and better ( most things would be better ) or nothing. All this in a timely manner too, my relationship with my GF has fizzled off too, and I'm good with that. Freedom.  

Dragoonback said: 

Tryptamine said: 

"Death does not make hedonism a dead end. It only makes pleasure temporary, and everything available to a mortal organism is temporary. A pleasant experience does not become worthless because it ends, just as suffering does not become meaningful because it ends in death."

not true from the start

things being temporal and without a purpose does indeed make hedonism meaningless. unless "meaning" to you is simply hits of feel-good neurotransmitters. something to think about

I am affirming that there is no objective meaning. My point is that this doesn't uniquely undermine hedonism. If everything is ultimately without purpose, then every philosophy faces the same condition. Hedonism doesn't become a "dead end" because the universe lacks meaning. It simply values pleasurable experiences within a meaningless universe. You're criticizing it for failing to provide something that I don't think exists in the first place.

it is mutually exclusive with other ways of being

Tryptamine said: 

it is mutually exclusive with other ways of being

My point is not that hedonism creates some deeper purpose. It is that temporary experiences do not require an objective purpose to be preferred by a conscious organism.

If everything is ultimately meaningless, then no framework escapes that condition. Hedonism is not uniquely a dead end; it is simply a preference for certain states of experience over others.

and what kind of deeper experience does hedonism create

Tryptamine said: 

and what kind of deeper experience does hedonism create

What deeper experience is hedonism supposed to create? It does not claim to reveal some higher purpose or ultimate truth. It simply prioritizes certain conscious experiences over others.

If your criticism is that pleasure does not provide objective meaning, then I agree, because I do not think objective meaning exists. But that does not make pleasure uniquely invalid. It just means it is another preference within an indifferent universe.