Sociopath Community

Tryptamine stated: source post

None of what you brought up has significant relevance to quantum mechanics.

Since neither of us are physicists, is your rebuttal really that my examples of variables as-yet-unaccounted-for don't perfectly fit into one branch of physics?

You can give me "more," if you'd like, but instead of trying to leverage uncertainty in a universe where objectivity is impossible, and no one here taking deterministic standpoints argue that it is, I'd like to see some evidence that there is free will.

Then you'd be better off asking someone who subscribes to that idea? >.< How many times do I need to say it...

I wonder how much the belief in free will vs determinism correlates with how many times a person's been left asking themselves why they do the things they do. 

Don't need to try. Uncertainty exists in surplus, and the reason I bring it up is because I haven't heard an argument for determinism that can't be reduced to "we observe one option, thus it was the only option". I'm saying that's simplistic.

"Since neither of us are physicists, is your rebuttal really that my examples of variables as-yet-unaccounted-for don't perfectly fit into one branch of physics?"

You said, "We're constantly being given hints that variables exist beyond the system we observe, and for that reason, hard determinism feels a bit lazy given modern advances in quantum physics." I asked for examples. You brought up dark matter, the flyby anomaly, etc. Firstly, these are not ideas that contradict hard determinism. Secondly, they have nothing to do with free will.

Spatial Mind has thus far brought up the best argument for free will that I've seen, and that is that microtubules behave under some quantum mechanic laws. Completely absurd given the structure and function of a neuron...you can tell from a Biology 101 class and looking at a picture of a neuron:

But at least Spatial, in his spiritual views which I will never agree with (and will no longer bother to argue with), brought up an actual cogent argument for QM and consciousness.

"Then you'd be better off asking someone who subscribes to that idea? >.< How many times do I need to say it..."

Just picking your brain since you seem to have different thoughts.

haart stated: source post

Don't need to try. Uncertainty exists in surplus, and the reason I bring it up is because I haven't heard an argument for determinism that can't be reduced to "we observe one option, thus it was the only option". I'm saying that's simplistic.

That is your perception of determinism? One option was observed, and that was the only option in this "wild and nebulous world of uncertainty?"

You're welcome to further evidence your position :P

"You brought up dark matter, the flyby anomaly, etc. Firstly, these are not ideas that contradict hard determinism."

They were more intended to illustrate the layers of reality that exist beyond our ability to perceive them. I feel like we're not on the same page here.

"Secondly, they have nothing to do with free will."

No shit. How many times do I... 

haart stated: source post

You're welcome to further evidence your position :P

I feel at this juncture, it's you who needs to come up with evidence. I've put plenty out, but still have yet to hear a good argument for free will. 

haart stated: source post

"You brought up dark matter, the flyby anomaly, etc. Firstly, these are not ideas that contradict hard determinism."

They were more intended to illustrate the layers of reality that exist beyond our ability to perceive them. I feel like we're not on the same page here.

"Secondly, they have nothing to do with free will."

No shit. How many times do I... 

Again, you are leveraging uncertainty. It amazes me that someone who works in the medical field could be oblivious to causality at the human level.

Also, please stop cursing.

Tryptamine stated: source post

 

haart stated: source post

You're welcome to further evidence your position :P

I feel at this juncture, it's you who needs to come up with evidence. I've put plenty out, but still have yet to hear a good argument for free will. 

XD

haart stated: source post

"You brought up dark matter, the flyby anomaly, etc. Firstly, these are not ideas that contradict hard determinism."

They were more intended to illustrate the layers of reality that exist beyond our ability to perceive them. I feel like we're not on the same page here.

"Secondly, they have nothing to do with free will."

No shit. How many times do I... 

Again, you are leveraging uncertainty. It amazes me that someone who works in the medical field could be oblivious to causality at the human level.

Okay, we're definitely not on the same page. What about dark matter or the Flyby anomaly, or unobserved layers of reality gave you the impression I was speaking of a human level?