Sociopath Community

Cawk said: 

Kestrel said: 

Get rid of the shit, valueless threads he makes. If anything or even nothing takes it's place it's a better move for the forum. 

The line should be drawn on the deletion of topics if it's multiple clickbait threads with an emphasis on making people reactionary. I'd put a thread limit at 3 per day on him, or on anyone in general tbh.

Yes, let's censor trolling and turn this into a place for nerds, where only highly intellectual discussions must happen.

 Nah, keeping the impulsive autism spam to a minimum is not a censor to trolling. Plenty of quality shitpost can be made without it being qualified as spam. Your threads aren't even trolls for the most part, they just read like random thought strings you had in the moment. 

Good said: 

Turncoat said: 

Good said:

Not acting towards what has to be done because of fear is defeatist.

I'd call it cause and effect, ones with past references that serve as examples for the why. 

To rush in blindly is to be defeat-ed.

You do not suggest an alternative, you suggest we just cower in fear. I see no alternative, therefore I think it is best to act if the deterrent is just possible raids.

The alternative is what we're doing now (not have been doing, what we're doing right now). 

If you put in the rule itself that the mod can be subjective, which is absolutely normal, so there cant be calls for hypocrisy among the rational users.

The minute you do that is the minute you justify Luna and Ed's modding styles, and allowing for poor behavior on a whim from mods has led to many community deaths. Having a protocol that mods are expected to follow helps with both the users gaining a set of straight forward expectations and for keeping mods under control. Should mods ever have to be deputized, straight-forward guidelines will make that less of a potential problem. 

The minute it becomes about the mod being able to do whatever it wants is the minute that it becomes a popularity contest with actions that can be justified over absolutely nothing. It's better to be smart about it before there's problems, especially when the problems risk becoming repetitions of history. 

Something needs to keep the mods in check, and a consistency basis through established norms is how to render it robotic and impersonal, as it ought to be.

The community will keep mods in check. And it is unrealistic to not be subjective, it is the same in the legal sphere, where people are trying their best to be objective. But if you insist, the alternative is to ban it altogether. I am proposing a better solution. 

You must trust the mods you pick in the first place anyway.

Mods need to be able to make judgment calls and live with the consequences, which to be real, are not so big on this site. 

An established set of practices that prove to be unbroken sends a message, builds a reputation upon itself that resonates from it's foundation and otherwise sets the tone, what people can expect. We've been able to sustain this before with no real trouble, and it helps make it bigger than any one person, something that is integral to our core and was principally what had us overpower Luna as one voice many times in the past. It was only once mods had nothing to hold them back during Edvard's era that people became more disillusioned about their part in the greater whole. 

Mods can't be trusted, not on their own, we're still people and we're far from infallible. The constraints are also our stockades, and they're what give the users more justification for the room to voice their complaints compared to "I don't like that you did that!" does on it's own. 

It must be bigger than us, because it already is. 

Raids and such issues come to any community, even on SC where the rules were literary not to post illegal shit.

It's different once you start targeting arbitrary legal stuff. "Illegal" takes no time at all to explain to people, while legal lets people see a lack of consequence in their actions. 

It just opens more people to do be able to raid. We are not the first and only community, somehow other communities survive raids...

---

You sounded intimidated by possible raiders.

It's not just a fear of more potential raiders that ought to be the focus, but what it principally means to no longer allow ourselves to have that be part of our "Free Marketplace of Ideas". 

Him being on thin ice right now is also not intimidation, but rather establishment. When/if he fucks up this one final time, we'll be able to reference it forever. I'm not sitting here saying "it's hopeless", quite the opposite you're not only right here implementing developments, but these tools have been pretty damn great compared to what I'm used to, and I'm discussing this more so from the position of what to do with all of this power instead of how powerless we are. 

It really is a nice change of pace, Luna's forum really was me having to explain how I couldn't do anything, now it's merely principles discussions. 

This is the power we have, but its not the power the users of the site have. They have no direct control, only indirect thought me and the mods. 

The power we have should be somewhere between the community collective interest and our principled ideals. The power being in our hands means the power is in the user's hands... but with reasonable checks and balances in place to filter it into something more akin to the website. 

Sometimes we need to be reminded what we're fighting for in the short term, but at other times principles and ideals need... to adapt in the long term, and it's up to us overtime to see where that lies. 

I don't think a 100% anarchy is the best environment for something of value.

It's not anarchy, it's libertarian. 

No rules is anarchy and you are against even the smallest amount, beyond what is truly limiting (legal stuff). The model now is libertarian, but you prefer anarchy is what i meant. Like everyone moderating their posts is a definite form of anarchy(not that I am against it, but its an example).

It does not hurt my feelings. I just have no motivation to be here. Because the content is useless and repulsive. He is not attacking me, he is just repulsive.

You and cawk don't seem to understand how this content affects less disordered people.

This is a disordered forum, it is literally named after a disorder and it's drawn in majority dark triad traits towards the community, and you are arguing in favor of removing things because they hurt people's feelings. This forum was built on the back of hurt feelings. 

This isn't some hugbox, and once it becomes that we might as well change the name. 

How many people have to disappear?

The ones who stay gone for good leave for more personal reasons. 

This is not what SC was when I joined.

At it's foundation, it almost is, this is but an acne outbreak on the greater vision. 

---

Cawk said:

If there was anyone twisted like me here, I'd actually try to be friends with them, and as result, contribute to the site better.

...is this some sort of existential loneliness stemming from when you "realized" that Jim is "just some old cast normie like the rest of 'em"? 

With enough users like that, the place wouldn't be "overwhelmed by some asshole that aims to take advantage of those freedoms." as Turncoat described me. 

...yeah, it'd be more overwhelmed, by a group of them instead, all backing each other up and patting each other on the back for making people leave like it was before. 

I mostly try to keep that lot around to see if they'll come around and be normal users. Many of them do, so chances have proven worth giving in the past, but there's a point where to do nothing is no longer an option. 

 If there really were more users like me, the normies would likely end up fucking off back to Loona's and the thick skinned ones like me would stay.

What you describe as overwhelming would become the norm. It is just very noticeable currently when there's users who post topics about kittens and then when I post topics.

I'm assuming my trolling even gets to you, hence you called me an asshole.

Cawk said: 

---

Cawk said:

If there was anyone twisted like me here, I'd actually try to be friends with them, and as result, contribute to the site better.

...is this some sort of existential loneliness stemming from when you "realized" that Jim is "just some old cast normie like the rest of 'em"? 

No.

With enough users like that, the place wouldn't be "overwhelmed by some asshole that aims to take advantage of those freedoms." as Turncoat described me. 

...yeah, it'd be more overwhelmed, by a group of them instead, all backing each other up and patting each other on the back for making people leave like it was before. 

I mostly try to keep that lot around to see if they'll come around and be normal users. Many of them do, so chances have proven worth giving in the past, but there's a point where to do nothing is no longer an option. 

If there really were more users like me, the normies would likely end up fucking off back to Loona's and the thick skinned ones like me would stay.

What you describe as overwhelming would become the norm. It is just very noticeable currently when there's users who post topics about kittens and then when I post topics.

What you're talking about is something this place has never been, not even during the likes of Jim "in his prime" and "Negativity". This place is more dissimilar with your vision than even it's original naive "glory days" that people talk as if it was so hardcore. 

I'm assuming my trolling even gets to you, hence you called me an asshole.

I mean you're doing it to be an asshole, that's the goal, you've... clearly expressed that. You want to be seen as deplorable so that you can be awash in the infamy in place of whatever else isn't getting mental nourishment right now. You even take my having thrown an inflictive title at you as a bigger focal point than the times I've had positive things to say. That's... self-alienation through negativism. It's like you can only trust negative consequences while seeing anything else as inauthentic. 

I'm not going to sit here and say that there's no feelings going on whatsoever, that'd be ridiculous self-denial. I'm all for freedom of expression, but making a mess stops others from having their room to express other than through fighting fire with fire. I want it to work and at points it feels like you're working against me working for you, so I'm bound to have some feelings on the matter. 

I don't like giving up on people, it turns them into cartoon characters. 

TL;DL:

Turncoat bitchslaps Cawk around, since the community wants Cawk's head and there's no more Jim disapproval about it. The bitchslaps are hesitant though and filled with mixed signals of tolerance/intolerance, because TC is scared of the full-force Cawk autism which in itself would shake things up for his modship and make his anti-"anti cp measures" crusade laughable.

Cawk has to behave like a good dog and censor himself, because otherwise he gets the ban. Will he go against his own freedom of speech and censorship crusade to keep his e-place here?

Either way, something's got to change, and someone will come out bruised from it :D

Edvard said: 

TL;DL:

Turncoat bitchslaps Cawk around, since the community wants Cawk's head and there's no more Jim disapproval about it. The bitchslaps are hesitant though and filled with mixed signals of tolerance/intolerance, because TC is scared of the full-force Cawk autism which in itself would shake things up for his modship and make his anti-"anti cp measures" crusade laughable.

Cawk has to behave like a good dog and censor himself, because otherwise he gets the ban. Will he go against his own freedom of speech and censorship crusade to keep his e-place here?

Either way, something's got to change, and someone will come out bruised from it :D

Your version, like usual, is... dubious. 

I'm not sure what would amuse me more... You having to ban Cawk on sight after you kept banging on about what a mistake that was on the old SC, or Cawk suddenly behaving himself after his leash being tugged and the rod waved in front of him :D

You really don't see the differences? 

Turncoat said: 

Cawk said: 

---

Cawk said:

If there was anyone twisted like me here, I'd actually try to be friends with them, and as result, contribute to the site better.

...is this some sort of existential loneliness stemming from when you "realized" that Jim is "just some old cast normie like the rest of 'em"? 

No.

Hm, alright. 

The loneliness angle is new though, you always liked to brag in another's stead. Now that you're this "Big Alfa Dawg" or whatever you realize it's lonely at the top and that no one around here is appreciating what you're doing (beyond some of the subtleties from a few who bothered to try to read into you). 

When Jim was around, he even enabled some of your pettier behavior, and with him gone you still have the same desires with no one to validate it for you.

You rebuke us because you feel rebuked, but you feel it before it's the reality so instead you end up in a strangely defensive self-fulfilling prophecy. 

 

With enough users like that, the place wouldn't be "overwhelmed by some asshole that aims to take advantage of those freedoms." as Turncoat described me. 

...yeah, it'd be more overwhelmed, by a group of them instead, all backing each other up and patting each other on the back for making people leave like it was before. 

I mostly try to keep that lot around to see if they'll come around and be normal users. Many of them do, so chances have proven worth giving in the past, but there's a point where to do nothing is no longer an option. 

If there really were more users like me, the normies would likely end up fucking off back to Loona's and the thick skinned ones like me would stay.

What you describe as overwhelming would become the norm. It is just very noticeable currently when there's users who post topics about kittens and then when I post topics.

What you're talking about is something this place has never been

Instead it had prideful, middle aged losers larping, threatening each other, of which nothing ever came out of any instances.

My vision is better.

I'm not going to sit here and say that there's no feelings going on whatsoever, that'd be ridiculous self-denial. I'm all for freedom of expression, but making a mess stops others from having their room to express other than through fighting fire with fire. I want it to work and at points it feels like you're working against me working for you, so I'm bound to have some feelings on the matter. 

I'm definitely not with you, but I expect you to uphold the site principles.

Cawk said: 

You rebuke us because you feel rebuked, but you feel it before it's the reality so instead you end up in a strangely defensive self-fulfilling prophecy. 

I'm extremely good at reading people. Don't buy into Alena's story.