Sociopath Community

So what do you figure's going on other than The Proximity Principle? 

Turncoat said: 

I'm just explaining how this isn't pure honeypot. 

From looking over our past discussions, I've seen that if I drop too much of my own opinion that you just shut down if not distract you over some nonsense. Rather than that, I'd prefer to get your version first so that it'll be that much easier to stay on topic. With how much you attempt to appeal to the 'common sense' narrative by being intentionally vague you're clearly trying to bait out presumptions from your audience rather than actually have a real discussion. 

Our past discussions, not this one ? That's real vague.

What I wrote is for Friedrich. You might not understand it still, but that's fine. When I'm talking to you, I'll give you the ultra easy version to the best of my ability. I'm not obliged to answer your question cause it'll turn into another question and another.

At times I do shut down because like I recently stated our discussions turn into walls of nonsense. It has nothing to do with your opinion, but more about the fuckery of you swinging to "Oh I have your screenshots of the past, no I won't show you them" 

You came in, you took jabs right away. Like dude, you argued about flowers, and you brought it up yet again as a means to belittle me, like I have no idea what people use them for. Now you're vexed cause I won't elaborate on this Proximity Principal you brought to the table. I said Proximity Principal is in effect by default.

ALSO, you said it's the Proximity Principal and nothing more to it. I'm fine with you having your own opinion. I honestly don't have anything to add to your opinion, nor do I take away anything from it. This clearly means, I'm not agreeing, or disagreeing. You say there's nothing more to it, I'm fine with that. Truly I am.

You just want me to elaborate on their strolling, then provoke me for whatever I have to say about it in detail. 

Yes, I would love to have more details on your theories here. I've even presented 'The Proximity Principle' as a comparison, whether to confirm that you only meant that aspect of social psychology or if you might have been looking at it from a different angle entirely. 

This proximity principle within itself is loaded. I'd say close proximity is obviously the case, but I never based what I wrote on that while passing it off such a principle "nothing more"

What do you mean by 'loaded', like full of shit? 

Nope. Loaded as in being within close proximity with someone and forming a relationship has a number of variables and attributes that condition the relationship. Being around someone can also be chaotic.

Now I know you want to talk about this Proximity Principal but it's loaded. They can get along, or they can fall out, you're free to say "it's just a Proximity Principal and nothing more" just as I'm free to think it's all that and what I already wrote.

What else do you figure's going on then, pheromones? 

Originally I stated that at least 1 of them is going to fall for the other. That's usually the case. I also suggested if he makes her feel comfortable about being hefty, she'll be drawn to him more than anticipated. There's plenty of signs and signals in what he wrote. The fact he's even telling us about her is 1 of many things.

It may surprise you, but I'm an expert when it comes to these things. Just like I was the expert in Feather's threads, being able to correctly identify what she really wanted, while you came charging.

I'm literally asking for your take on it but you seem reluctant to part with it, as if you're worried it'd not be hard to pick apart or something. If tearing it down proves to be provocative then that'd just mean you elaborating further on your ideas right? 

 Yes I'm reluctant to part with what exactly ? I nearly forgot

Your take on what's going on other than The Proximity Principle, focus. 

I don't expect intelligent conversation with you. It's already gotten ridiculous, this is Friedrich's thread, you should be asking him questions if you haven't an answer for him.

You're the one who's trying to not talk... 

That's right. I think I explained why that is somewhere around here, maybe in the other thread.

In here you can read the first page. You came in swinging. Cool. We carried on fine. You took more swings. "Whatever makes you feel better dude" Okay you can sidetrack and keep swinging, but don't get sour if I'm not obliged to spoon feed you answers to your inquiries when you keep rubbing me the wrong way.

You can be the victim and act like I'm shutting down because of your opinion, but really TC. It has more to do with your poor manners.

Maybe post the screenshots already.

In this case I'm asking for things that are on topic, but you can't seem to focus. 

I can focus. But like I said, manners. I'm letting you know, you did it wrong.

You came in. Gave me a wedgie talking about your silly flower accusation. Dropped your logic, maybe here or the other thread you called me a liar, mentioned bending me into shape by posting things I wrote in the past ( which I'd like you to do, even though I know you cannot technically bring me anything I've said and done and use it against me )

I know from experience. If I elaborated, which would have been a waste of time, this encounter would turn out just like this. Trust me. Sometimes the conversations chill, but when it goes sour I know in advance.

I wrote what I wrote. It isn't complicated. Your perception about what I wrote may seem like magical thinking, but it isn't. It's just a reflection on what Friedrich wrote.

I didn't say anything about magical thinking at all, I've just been asking for elaboration.

Again. Manners.

Am I supposed to compare what I wrote to the Proximity Principle ? What is the divide exactly ? This Proximity Principle is in effect by default. 

What do you figure The Proximity Principle is..? 

Maybe it's, what I read it is ?

 

When it comes to a comparison of perceptions both people need to have some canon of understanding between them. With you you have a habit of keeping things just vague enough for others to jump to conclusions, something I've seen stop working when you're otherwise asked to elaborate. This is something older users here used to have more patience with you over, questioning what you really meant as it'd turn into pages of you being defensively confused. 

Okay. But how do you know if I'm obliged to accommodate bad manners or not ?

It's basic stuff. Play some ball with the woman. Don't let others ruin whatever it is they have, be careful when 1on1 with a woman, usually 1 will fall for the other. They stroll daily on their break, it's their time, he knows her eating habits for lunch. He's talking about her, She's "kinda" his friend. Proximity Principals ? Sure ! why not !

Are they dating ? Well pretty much. They say they aren't, and no they aren't together, but by definition they are regardless of what anyone says.

 You have me breaking 10,000 Characters, which is unlimited for moderators, but not users. Hence the reason I had to delete some of the quotes.

Turcoat said:

I'm asking for the meat of your points rather than just the garnish you'd use to have others think you know what you're talking about.

You have to be on my good side though. 

And there's nothing wrong with people thinking I know what I'm talking about. You wouldn't and I understand, but I can't always take the time to break down one thing that leads to another with you this often. See how this thread is turning out ? Don't blame me for trying to avoid this.

Like a Math teacher I'm asking you to explain your work instead of just writing down the answers, like an English teacher I'm asking you to narrate what you mean instead of presuming your audience to understand what's in your head, and like a Science teacher I'm asking you to show your data, trials, experiments, etc.

If you're going to compare this to school, they're the ones that actually tend to push that people show more rather than less.

 Manners though.

You came. You called me a liar tonight, maybe here or was it in the other thread. You constantly take swings. You accused me of other things tonight here and on the other thread. You brought the same old flower argument, like I have a limited capacity to understand why people use flowers. A grudge.

Do I think your inquiry is bait ? Absolutely.

Life is peachy tonight. I'm in a different moon right now, ( me and FOTS have been enjoying ourselves in the trade group and it's still going )

and I still gave you time even though I'm distracted right now.

It's not your opinion, trust me.

Spatial Mind:
I'm the wisest
You may feel like I'm being condescending
One thing I know for sure
People have to learn the hard way
So often do I watch my warnings unfold
Then in comes the hard times
But this is good, because you'll learn
But sometimes
Someone
Not one of you here now, but sometimes, one of you will rise up, and hear me
And when the train crashes, they remain standing
Amen, and Awoman
Peace and joy
Now go and play
As you forget what I say
But you WILL learn
Eventually

Literally hopeless, as if you can't take in data unless it feels good or something. 

Spatial Mind said: 

You have me breaking 10,000 Characters, which is unlimited for moderators, but not users. Hence the reason I had to delete some of the quotes.

That's not true at all..? If that were true I wouldn't be on my third Number of the Day topic, nor would I need to split the longer chat logs when copying them to a topic into multiple posts. 

See, you don't even need accurate or complete data before you're already writing off conclusions. 

Turcoat said:

I'm asking for the meat of your points rather than just the garnish you'd use to have others think you know what you're talking about.

You have to be on my good side though. 

---

Manners though.

If we were to stick purely to your 'good side' as we've tried in the past you still end up not answering questions, and it's been the case even when people outside of me, such as Legga, have been involved. As he said you go into every situation with the idea that you have enough data already, while he and I are the sort to presume we're looking at an incomplete picture. 

I'm thinking you just respond poorly to being questioned for elaboration, I've never seen it be this difficult for someone barring a language difficulty. It should not be this difficult to discuss the root workings of your beliefs over attraction. 

And there's nothing wrong with people thinking I know what I'm talking about.

There is when it turns out, post elaboration, that you had no idea what you were going on about. Again, older users both knew and had the patience to ask you for further explanation only for it to bite you over how it wasn't as sensible as it sounded when it was left vague (like when you tried to make up rumors about Ed only to say you 'lost them' lolol).

Rather than assume to know what you mean I figure it'd be doing us both a service to just ask for clarity, especially when that's been your go-to for trying to prove that people aren't really listening to you once they go to said presumptions you're aiming to bait out of them. Effectively, you're hoping they take the presumptive bait so that you're given room to correct them, but if they instead ask for you to say your version first your confidence runs dry these days over expecting it to be some sort of trap. Even when they end up presuming that what you said was a joke I've seen you nod your head and agree for the approval points until questioned about it again later. 

It's a classic Narc trick to keep it vague over seeing that it gets more people to agree, whether because they assumed you meant the version they presume, which may in itself also be incorrect or at the very least different from your own, or from them being 'polite company' who'd see such honesty as being rude. I personally put honesty before politeness and often see that sugarcoating the words just has the message become lost. Most end up just giving in to their own exhaustion rather than really help the person, and in your case with your inability to have it go anywhere I'm starting to understand why. 

It's the 'Keep them Guessing' strategy that's meant to put power in the one with the answers' hands, but once asked for said answers it doesn't usually go like this for others who employ it. 

You wouldn't and I understand, but I can't always take the time to break down one thing that leads to another with you this often. See how this thread is turning out ? Don't blame me for trying to avoid this. 

Do I think your inquiry is bait ? Absolutely.

I've just been trying to have you elaborate on what else is at play other than 'The Proximity Effect', beyond that it's been me trying to put a stop to this over how you won't improve. 

Your 'avoidance' is overall, you can't even elaborate on your own points beyond extrapolation over how you're not a hard person to understand, putting it entirely on your audience rather than your own ability to explain yourself. 

You came. You called me a liar tonight, maybe here or was it in the other thread. You constantly take swings. You accused me of other things tonight here and on the other thread. You brought the same old flower argument, like I have a limited capacity to understand why people use flowers. A grudge.

I brought up the flowers thing as a referential bit... 

Wait is that what set you off? Would we be having a normal discussion right now if I didn't make a joke about flowers? 

Life is peachy tonight. I'm in a different moon right now, ( me and FOTS have been enjoying ourselves in the trade group and it's still going )

Thanks for the reassurance that you aren't sore over any of this, I guess. 

Spatial Mind said: 

Our past discussions, not this one ? 

I'm trying to work on myself at this point by looking over our former discussions for patterns, as my need for you to stop being so deluded is really distracting when I could otherwise be avoiding these clashes with you over them entirely. 

With others the clashes bear fruit, they show pieces of themselves and I do the same back as the questions and points further the debate. Through the differences in our opinions I tend to be able to find where we agree and disagree within it's duration as well as see some room for the two to appeal to and become that much more like each other through the increased understanding, but with you there's no hope so I just need to learn how to not trigger you this much. 

What I wrote is for Friedrich. You might not understand it still, but that's fine. When I'm talking to you, I'll give you the ultra easy version to the best of my ability. I'm not obliged to answer your question cause it'll turn into another question and another.

You're so busy expecting traps that you can't even have a normal conversation anymore. 

At times I do shut down because like I recently stated our discussions turn into walls of nonsense.

Just because you don't understand it doesn't render it nonsense, and if you'd bother to read any of it you'd have the room to ask me to elaborate on them if not question where it's coming from. 

Instead I pour hours of my time into showing you screencaps and old logs, into narrating your own history for your benefit, and you spit in my face for it over how it makes you feel bad and doesn't conform to how you'd prefer you see yourself. Most people have an easier time facing their own darkness than you do and it's really throwing me off how much you'd prefer to pretend it's not even there. 

It has nothing to do with your opinion, but more about the fuckery of you swinging to "Oh I have your screenshots of the past, no I won't show you them" 

I have literally shown you them at least three separate times, likely more. 

Even The Buddha only has patience in threes, you expect too much. 

You came in, you took jabs right away. Like dude, you argued about flowers, and you brought it up yet again as a means to belittle me, like I have no idea what people use them for.

I really didn't think it'd have this profound of an effect to bring up flowers. 

Now you're vexed cause I won't elaborate on this Proximity Principal you brought to the table. I said Proximity Principal is in effect by default.

Yeah but you won't go any further than that, your post before's just about being nice and playing sports and shit, and since then you've only repeated the 'at least one of them is amorous for the other' point without any backing. 

Considering how much you've gone on about attraction in general with the odd points over it that you've once made, elaboration's needed more from you than others here from how much it departs from modern convention at times. If you'd never been made to elaborate on related points before you'd have come off as significantly more conventional, but as we've both seen time and time again your explanations tend to be a bit based. 

ALSO, you said it's the Proximity Principal and nothing more to it.

I was asking you if there was more to it than that. 

I'm fine with you having your own opinion. I honestly don't have anything to add to your opinion, nor do I take away anything from it. This clearly means, I'm not agreeing, or disagreeing. You say there's nothing more to it, I'm fine with that. Truly I am.

---

Now I know you want to talk about this Proximity Principal but it's loaded. They can get along, or they can fall out, you're free to say "it's just a Proximity Principal and nothing more" just as I'm free to think it's all that and what I already wrote.

But you aren't even really understanding what's being said to you. 🤦

You're like the Dunning Kruger Effect personified I swear. 

That's right. I think I explained why that is somewhere around here, maybe in the other thread.

In here you can read the first page. You came in swinging. Cool.

It was one sentence where I questioned your point and referred to flowers holy shit dude. 

We carried on fine. You took more swings. "Whatever makes you feel better dude"

At that point you were already falling headfirst back into the lies you tell yourself, and while it is difficult for me to just walk away and watch you continue on like that you're showing me that the only thing I can do for you is pity you. 

So yeah, whatever makes you feel better dude, this is me trying to not fight with you over your delusions. 

Okay you can sidetrack and keep swinging, but don't get sour if I'm not obliged to spoon feed you answers to your inquiries when you keep rubbing me the wrong way.

But you don't answer clearly even when it's those who rub you the right way unless it's over personal opinion rather than rooted in fact. Your only elaborations are anecdotal whenever you'd bother, you live a life where you believe yourself to be above the need for proof and it's fucking weird to me by contrast as someone who goes out of my way to explain myself for their benefit. 

You're great at narrating your surface level beliefs, but you can't really go any deeper than that. Where I'd presume much of it to be a gun shy reluctance over expecting traps and bait, I'm now more starting to wonder if you just don't think these things through. 

You can be the victim and act like I'm shutting down because of your opinion, but really TC. It has more to do with your poor manners.

Maybe post the screenshots already.

I have for multiple already's, you've proven to me more than once that there's no point in it... and if anything your begging me to post it is straight haunting when I can still remember how it went the last times. 

Even when I hadn't posted any yet in recency you'd already begun to slip back in to posting dox info, so I'm just going to leave you to your delusions. 

You came in. Gave me a wedgie talking about your silly flower accusation. Dropped your logic, maybe here or the other thread you called me a liar, mentioned bending me into shape by posting things I wrote in the past ( which I'd like you to do, even though I know you cannot technically bring me anything I've said and done and use it against me )

I know from experience. If I elaborated, which would have been a waste of time, this encounter would turn out just like this. Trust me. Sometimes the conversations chill, but when it goes sour I know in advance. 

I really didn't expect you to be this sensitive over one sentence. 

How would you know though if you can't even allow yourself to have a normal conversation? I just was questioning your point on attraction and you made it into this whole big hullabaloo again. 

I wrote what I wrote. It isn't complicated. Your perception about what I wrote may seem like magical thinking, but it isn't. It's just a reflection on what Friedrich wrote.

I didn't say anything about magical thinking at all, I've just been asking for elaboration.

Again. Manners.

But I really didn't say you were going on about magical thinking, that hasn't come up from me at all today towards you. 

I could say that your putting words in my mouth is far more rude. 

What do you figure The Proximity Principle is..? 

Maybe it's, what I read it is?

In other words you don't know and are liable to look it up when you eventually feel pressured enough to say, I'll just stop this portion right here then for both of our convenience. 

On topic: 

This proximity principle within itself is loaded. I'd say close proximity is obviously the case, but I never based what I wrote on that while passing it off such a principle "nothing more"

What do you mean by 'loaded', like full of shit? 

Nope. Loaded as in being within close proximity with someone and forming a relationship has a number of variables and attributes that condition the relationship. Being around someone can also be chaotic.

See I never would have presumed that to be what you meant by the word 'loaded', I was thinking stuff like 'Loaded Question', 'Loaded Gun', 'Loading a game', etc. 

Being around someone can be Chaotic, but The Proximity Principle states that you're still more likely to assume relationships between those closer in proximity than if they are otherwise further apart, and that those presumptions translate into our psychology when we're otherwise around the same people every day. It's the same notion that claims we're more likely to pick the person we sit next to on the bus every morning over our 'perfect mate'. 

What else do you figure's going on then, pheromones? 

Originally I stated that at least 1 of them is going to fall for the other. That's usually the case.

This is the point I was questioning that you wouldn't go further on. 

What has this happen? 

I also suggested if he makes her feel comfortable about being hefty, she'll be drawn to him more than anticipated.

Well duh, compliments appease the ego and that tends to make them friendlier, especially if it's over a sore area. I didn't question the power of flattery, be it genuine or insincere. 

There's plenty of signs and signals in what he wrote. The fact he's even telling us about her is 1 of many things.

Assuming the story's real of course, but that's not really my point. 

It may surprise you, but I'm an expert when it comes to these things. Just like I was the expert in Feather's threads, being able to correctly identify what she really wanted, while you came charging.

That's cool I didn't ask to see your resume, just your data. 

Spatial Mind said: 

Are they dating ? Well pretty much. They say they aren't, and no they aren't together, but by definition they are regardless of what anyone says.

...please tell me this is a joke, with you I can't tell. 

I can just imagine you using this logic to tell yourself and others that you go 'on plenty of dates' or 'have dated many women'. 

tldr; what does this all have to do with Friedrich's fat female friend..? I could try to be invested. But then...... You would just end up disappointing me. Why bother?

Turncoat said: 

Spatial Mind:
I'm the wisest
You may feel like I'm being condescending
One thing I know for sure
People have to learn the hard way
So often do I watch my warnings unfold
Then in comes the hard times
But this is good, because you'll learn
But sometimes
Someone
Not one of you here now, but sometimes, one of you will rise up, and hear me
And when the train crashes, they remain standing
Amen, and Awoman
Peace and joy
Now go and play
As you forget what I say
But you WILL learn
Eventually

Literally hopeless, as if you can't take in data unless it feels good or something. 

Man. I can't even write funny shit in the chat log anymore eh ?

Like. I added Amen and Awoman.

I bet you save all my silliness and take it seriously.

That'll be enough. Tired.

Spatial Mind said: 

I bet you save all my silliness and take it seriously.

I address that above, alongside how surprisingly little you need to come to mistaken conclusions. 

That'll be enough. Tired.

It's Thanksgiving, I kind of figured it'd at least be a ceasefire. 

It'd probably be best for both of us that I stop trying to show you yourself, especially with how much you typically won't reciprocate the effort usually involved or end up forgetting it all later anyway. I can refrain from bringing up flowers around you, it clearly triggers you.