Sociopath Community

Astamiss stated: source post

I still don't think she had to the right to lower my grades. 

External cases that lead to lowered grades always inspired me to complain to the principle. I've gotten teachers in trouble more than once this way.
 

Astamiss stated: source post

You're right though and this is what I agree with the most. I just don't know what to think... I mean for all I know the next Einstein will have Asperger and the next Steven Hawking will have Schizophrenia. I don't know what to do with the parents that think they would not want a child with disability though end up not wanting their child any other way. I am conflicted. What do you think? 

The world will never know what they're missing if that child is never born. It's a what if chance that has less than a 0.1% chance of happening in the first place. If Einstein of Steven Hawking were never born, would we know the difference any more than if some Adam Atkins or Valerie Shapiro were born? No, we'd go on exactly as we are in a slightly altered direction. 

Hahah she certainly didn't.

are you blind or smth

Depends on the functionality and disability of the affected twin. If the child has promising hope of being competent as a regular human being, I'd do nothing. If however the child was guaranteed a life without standard mental faculties, I'd follow through with the wishes of the mother. I'd want the same if they were my children.

You're right though and this is what I agree with the most. I just don't know what to think... I mean for all I know the next Einstein will have Asperger and the next Steven Hawking will have Schizophrenia. I don't know what to do with the parents that think they would not want a child with disability though end up not wanting their child any other way. I am conflicted. What do you think? 

I guess it is true. I think having a child is selfish enough on its own. I know the child has no right to speak if they want to live. I might as well try to have the best set up for my child to succeed.

I think it is not living to the full potential. I would want to have a life worth living not a life of surviving. 

Dildo Faggins stated: source post

Because when it's known that you're carrying twins and only one comes home someone is going to want to know what happened to the other twin.

By telling the relatives the other twin has died you effectively stop them from wondering too much because the death of a child hurts, and it would be insensitive to ask the mother.  loved ones often want to know what's happening to the mother and the children and they'll go to the doctor or nurses for updates.

This mother didn't want her family knowing that she was giving one twin up so she asked the clinicians to lie.

^ This. This is the meat and bones of the dilemma. However, my opinion of who ought to know, why the mother wants to hide the messy business from her family, and how to handle it is different from yours.

Childbirth is a hideously painful, messy, humiliating and degrading experience under the best of circumstances. When you're shackled to that labour table, it's close to absolute helplessness and  fucking torture. Most people know this. But what most people don't quite grasp is what childbirth hormones can do to a woman's head throughout the process. Your entire body, mind and emotional presence are on fire with the hormone rush. The emotional (psychic?) pain is almost unbearable as well.

Any situation that presents itself during the ordeal as a disappointment fucking HURTS  like 5 times more than it would when you're in a normal headspace bc of the stupid childbirth hormones. I started to cry over my missing dessert when I was in hospital with my daughter. lol

I can't imagine having to make a choice like that girl did.

I understand why she wouldn't want to listen to her nagging relatives after being forced (by nature) to make those awful choices. I mean, everybody and their uncle... people who have never even had kids... always want to tell women what to do with their kids. Like it's any of  their  fucking business.

Wanting to hide her decision from her family is probably her way of maintaining what likely feels to her like her last shred of personal dignity and autonomy.

@ haart: Ignore what I said this morning. That was me trying to multitask through a nicotine jones and too little time. lol. This is why your field never interested me. Blah. Ethical conundrums. I hate them  :P

Is there a way for your colleague to do what his/her peers expect to be done (honesty and transparency) while still protecting the mother's privacy? Where I am, there are strict confidentiality laws. Doctors don't have to lie for patients bc patients' families are  not allowed  to know what happens in delivery rooms unless consent forms are signed.

This would be a non-issue where I am bc the family would not be allowed to ask wth happened to the other twin. The mother would be able to tell them w/e she wants.

Firstly, should have mentioned that I'm not sure where the father sits in all of this. I'm assuming he knew and was complicit. Not sure though, should find out and report back if anyone is interested. If was was also told the lie, it would be an added conundrum.

Systematic stated: source post

Depends on the functionality and disability of the affected twin. If the child has promising hope of being competent as a regular human being, I'd do nothing. If however the child was guaranteed a life without standard mental faculties, I'd follow through with the wishes of the mother. I'd want the same if they were my children.

As is, doctors (here) have no say in the validity of an abortion (aside from time, of course). She was free to abort as she saw fit. I don't disagree with this process, but I'm not an obstetrician. 

Xena stated: source post

 

Dildo Faggins stated: source post

Because when it's known that you're carrying twins and only one comes home someone is going to want to know what happened to the other twin.

By telling the relatives the other twin has died you effectively stop them from wondering too much because the death of a child hurts, and it would be insensitive to ask the mother.  loved ones often want to know what's happening to the mother and the children and they'll go to the doctor or nurses for updates.

This mother didn't want her family knowing that she was giving one twin up so she asked the clinicians to lie.

 

 

^ This. This is the meat and bones of the dilemma. However, my opinion of who ought to know, why the mother wants to hide the messy business from her family, and how to handle it is different from yours.

 

Childbirth is a hideously painful, messy, humiliating and degrading experience under the best of circumstances. When you're shackled to that labour table, it's close to absolute helplessness and  fucking torture. Most people know this. But what most people don't quite grasp is what childbirth hormones can do to a woman's head throughout the process. Your entire body, mind and emotional presence are on fire with the hormone rush. The emotional (psychic?) pain is almost unbearable as well.

Any situation that presents itself during the ordeal as a disappointment fucking HURTS  like 5 times more than it would when you're in a normal headspace bc of the stupid childbirth hormones. I started to cry over my missing dessert when I was in hospital with my daughter. lol

I can't imagine having to make a choice like that girl did.

I understand why she wouldn't want to listen to her nagging relatives after being forced (by nature) to make those awful choices. I mean, everybody and their uncle... people who have never even had kids... always want to tell women what to do with their kids. Like it's any of  their  fucking business.

Wanting to hide her decision from her family is probably her way of maintaining what likely feels to her like her last shred of personal dignity and autonomy.

 

@ haart: Ignore what I said this morning. That was me trying to multitask through a nicotine jones and too little time. lol. This is why your field never interested me. Blah. Ethical conundrums. I hate them  :P

Is there a way for your colleague to do what his/her peers expect to be done (honesty and transparency) while still protecting the mother's privacy? Where I am, there are strict confidentiality laws. Doctors don't have to lie for patients bc patients' families are  not allowed  to know what happens in delivery rooms unless consent forms are signed.

This would be a non-issue where I am bc the family would not be allowed to ask wth happened to the other twin. The mother would be able to tell them w/e she wants.

Our laws RE: confidentiality are similarly strict. That wasn't the problem here. Doctors are under legal obligation to deny information (as requested - given capacity to do so - meaning that there are exceptions when a person is without the cognitive capacity to privilege their medical information). BUT, this was a situation where the mother requested the doctors give false information. That isn't a legally protected area. Obviously, there's no legislation obligating doctors to lie, but similarly, there's no obligation that they don't. It was a choice.

Incidentally, this is all retrospective. The decision was made to "passively" support the mother's story. I.e. No elaboration, but no denial.

Moreover, it's complicated because - particularly in childbirth - there will inevitably be a million unavoidable questions from family. If they were to say "I'm not allowed to tell you" x50, suspicions would be raised. This was their justification for tacitly supporting the mother's lie.

Yes I am blind and am using a screen reader program with a sync Braille keyboard. Why do you ask?

Defiance stated: source post

I'd just be making the decision from the pov of 'which would be the least likely to get me sued, and which would look least bad if it was reported in the media'. Saying nothing or lying my omission seem like the safest options. 

Lol. That's pretty relevant in medical decision making.

I remember when I had a psych rotation, we had a client admitted under an assessment order that was protected by diplomatic immunity. We revoked the AO because... Lawsuit.... Even though the poor man desperately needed treatment. 

New Zealand has wonderful reforms protecting doctors from lawsuits. Australia is still with the US in our caution...