"it's starting to look like your cynicism is bordering on pretentious (no offense) to the point where you seem to dismiss things based on superficial ideas of it. everything needs to be deeper or it's laughable to you."
A superficial means of helping helps superficial people. Crow has a bit more going on than that, so being like "You're so smart, and so many people love you" wouldn't fix it if she were to be plagued with suicidal urges.
The root of the problem needs to be found, not just granting affirmation through recognition and flattery. That's important, but to use that as an attempted means of healing will make it seem increasingly fake overtime. Showing support helps, but it's never that simple.
"how about we stick to what's going on now rather than muddy the waters with past behaviors? just a suggestion."
It's hard to ignore a theme.
Well, I did feel like an idiot while reading through this thread, with such a debate going on.
Many people who are well above average in other areas of intelligence, have such seemingly inexplicable weak points. It's quite common. TC for instance, since I know you already respect his intelligence. I sometimes have to be outrageously specific with him, because there are certain types of things that he has a baffling misunderstanding of. He's still one of the most intelligent people I've ever known. But his thought process functions very differently from other people. While that usually works fine for him, sometimes it fails him in spectacular ways. It doesn't make him stupid, it's just a quirk.
I get what you are saying. Turn is a special case with a particular way of thinking. He has the tendency to overanalyze and make more connections than necessary and that probably leads to occasional "glitches", but some people don't make the connections at all. As I said, there is a "traditional" sense of the word stupid, for people who are GENERALLY slow and need more effort to understand things that the majority gets more easily. We've all met those people.
I ask him to pick up a box of cereal at the grocery store and he comes back with a bag of potatoes and a considerable monologue about the wonky train of thought that led him to believe that he should get me potatoes instead.
That is hardly "him failing in spectacular ways", lmao. I do that sometimes too, if I think another item is better or would be enjoyed by someone more than what I was supposed to get, I'd take that one instead :D (Also, you've probably taught him that disobedience means fun times haha.)
you're completely missing the point lol. regardless of what specific coddling (for lack of a better word before you go off on a tangent about it XD) crow would need, what i'm saying is wouldn't you try and help her to see the positive things in life if she were in such a state? or would you be like 'you're right, here's a shotgun'..the point i'm making is that if you did try to sway her toward looking at the positive you'd be doing the same thing many therapists do when working with suicidal patients.
i'm ok with whatever you want. if you want to try focusing on the present that's kewl. if you don't that too, is kewl.
at this point crow, the amount of times your statements have been debunked by me, it's odd that you don't seem to have learned to be a little smarter when it comes to these kind of back and forths. you can't just make blank statements, cos i always find the quote that contradicts everything you say and then you back off with your feathers between your legs. it's getting embarrassing now, and i especially don't want to have to remind you of all of those times as well as do it again right now :D
also, this would still work as a suggestion even if it were true that i hadn't done so in the past. still, next time bring a quote so i don't waste my time on your nonsense XD
Turncoat had the idea in a somewhat broader sense, but it is very specific here and a common culprit in numerous other disagreements: semantics.
The culprit of these debates is often the chain particular case -> generalization -> exceptions.
All generalizations are wrong at some point (maybe even this one haha) because the world/life is very complex and diverse. Our minds are limited, and it's easier to work with generalizations as abstract concepts. Plus, it gets too convoluted to say smth, then list all the possible exceptions to it, since the original idea would get lost in the process. But I believe there's also the implied/conventional knowledge that we DO work with generalizations, and we should take them as such. Like, when I call Tony stupid, I mean that his brain doesn't perform well enough to reach the truth way more often than other brains. Ofc there are exceptions to most shit we say or believe in. Like, Tony's brain could learn how to work with graphic 3D art stuff and programs, which others couldn't without loads of effort. A lot of debates arise from some people thinking about one category, while the others see the exceptions. Which is good, because we can fail to see the exceptions, and it's good someone brings them up, but also, we can risk getting fixated on the exceptions when by definition it's less likely to be confronted with them. Like, it's more likely to be confronted with Tony misunderstanding basic interactions and situations than Tony surprising you with his art intelligence.
I think it is better to be a fucking idiot. Fucking idiots never know that they are dumb and stupid, but the people around them have to put ut with their unintelligent ass. I think I rather be a happy idiot than a depressed smart person. Being smart only has me in utter rage the entire time because idiots are basically everywhere.