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Sociopaths - Sense of loyalty?


Posts: 207

 

by Turncoat

"Sociopaths can care for their families. We don't need proof of that."
I wouldn't mind having some proof of that beyond stories.

"Animals, even the cold blooded ones, feel compelled to protect their young"
Infanticide contradicts this. Male lions are a perfect example.

There's also animals like Turtles that bury their eggs and leave them alone for the wild to feast upon as they approach the waters. There's much of nature that possesses different perspectives on how to treat their young.

"But can sociopaths like someone enough to want to remain loyal despite cash benefits of the betrayal?"
That'd depend on if "sociopaths" are capable of forming attachments or not, and if said "sociopath" does or doesn't enjoy change. Beyond that, there's always the chance that the person they are "loyal" to is more interesting or stimulating than the alternatives they've been presented, and that the loyalty itself is preserved simply from the price of the exchange not being high enough.

"Everyone has a price."

Male lions usually kill cubs that aren't their own, not their own cubs. It's another form of natural selection to make sure it's your genes that are likely to thrive not anothers. If you've killed a male lion you can claim the Alpha male position and make sure your superior genes are the ones being preserved not those of the inferior members of the species.

It's not a perfect system but it's obviously worked.

I'm not saying ALL animals will automatically feel compelled to do this, but thinking about it logically, the animals that felt compelled to look after their young would most likely preserve their genetic legacy. If a being was to leave their child alone to die or kill them then their genes would be lost.

Sociopaths might not be able to love in the same way most others do, but sociopaths could see their children as extensions of themselves and thus want to develop them, even if it's only to suit their own narcissistic drive to feel good about themselves.

But I think the desire to look after young isn't always a fully emotional one, it can be an instinctive one. Even if you don't cry if they die, it's just something you do, and it's not just a societal standard. 

Posts: 10218
Sociopaths - Sense of loyalty?

"Sociopaths can care for their families. We don't need proof of that."
I wouldn't mind having some proof of that beyond stories.

"Animals, even the cold blooded ones, feel compelled to protect their young"
Infanticide contradicts this. Male lions are a perfect example.

There's also animals like Turtles that bury their eggs and leave them alone for the wild to feast upon as they approach the waters. There's much of nature that possesses different perspectives on how to treat their young.

"But can sociopaths like someone enough to want to remain loyal despite cash benefits of the betrayal?"
That'd depend on if "sociopaths" are capable of forming attachments or not, and if said "sociopath" does or doesn't enjoy change. Beyond that, there's always the chance that the person they are "loyal" to is more interesting or stimulating than the alternatives they've been presented, and that the loyalty itself is preserved simply from the price of the exchange not being high enough.

"Everyone has a price."

Posts: 1319
Sociopaths - Sense of loyalty?

I'm not someone who is going to go around labeling people around me, or make generalizations or fast judgments on people. Many of the sociopath characteristics and behaviors (used to determine if that person is a sociopath) inherently imply untrustworthiness so most of the time; if the person is a sociopath (and exhibits these symptoms) they are untrustworthy.

However something I have noticed in myself and in other people is, loyalty is almost solely derived from the two actors relationship and may in many cases this means that even though that person has a history of betrayal or impulsiveness that, that person can be loyal and trustworthy based on the personal relationship of the two actors. On the other hand it is always smarter to make sure they have a self interest in being loyal.

 

Posts: 3
Sociopaths - Sense of loyalty?

I think loyalty is dependent upon what need drew the two persons into the friendship/pact/whatever to begin with.  Obviously, there was a need for the alliance and, as long as that need exists, the two can remain within the confines of the friendship and be loyal.  I don't think cash is the only motivator, reward, or goal that exists or that is sought out and therefore would not necessarily cause betrayal.

Posts: 155
Sociopaths - Sense of loyalty?

Yes! There are many examples. I for one am one.

Posts: 207
Sociopaths - Sense of loyalty?

Sociopaths can kill without remorse, but quite often you see sociopaths form alliances and sometimes they don't betray each other despite there maybe being logical reasons to do so, e.g. profit.

Sociopaths can care for their families. We don't need proof of that. Animals, even the cold blooded ones, feel compelled to protect their young, but what about sociopaths and friendships/alliances?

I know a lot of sociopaths can be hitmen for hire, and will be loyal for cash...

But can sociopaths like someone enough to want to remain loyal despite cash benefits of the betrayal?

 

Posts: 3722
Sociopaths - Sense of loyalty?

are you answering as a sociopath?

Posts: 3722
Sociopaths - Sense of loyalty?

but your answer seems completely subjective..

Posts: 3246
Sociopaths - Sense of loyalty?

It doesn't take much effort to visualize how a bipolar thinks, or a person with Asperger's Syndrome thinks, or NPD, or sociopathy, or or schizophrenics (admittedly, that last group can prove difficult). Especially when one spent the time reading books and research papers on those topics, and has actually spent time with around people diagnosed with said conditions.

Posts: 364
Sociopaths - Sense of loyalty?

Loyalty acquired from money can be bought with more money.

A true loyalty is forged through mutual experiences, like collegues and such. When you know the person will get your back and they know you will too. No amount of money can buy this loyalty and only the people involved in it can break it. Get their backs they'll get yours even if that means getting beat up for them maybe one time you'll be in danger and they'll get you out for that one time you backed their ass.

Mutual benefits

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