I do understand, that only the insane equate pain with success.
But why are you willing to mimic what others' are willing to call a success?
10
posts
"Pain is the breaking of the shell that encloses our understanding." -- paraphrased from Kahlil Gibran
Noble Counselor:
(A) There is a difference between "no pain no gain" and causing "unnecessary pain."
NOTE: I believe gain can be made without pain, when you learn the process and don't fear it. Just like childbirth does not have to be so painful when it is conducted and accepted naturally, not made worse by restricting in fear of pain.
Some people may be seeking pleasure from causing pain to others, but I do not. I gain satisfaction from learning and teaching how to AVOID pain by "resolving conflicts" instead of projecting them forward and repeating them ad nauseum. (Unfortunately the work it takes to resolve conflicts also causes discomfort, which is confused with wanting to make people suffer. This again is not the goal of anyone like me who prefers diplomatic conflict resolution. I am guessing you prefer the same, if you are as distressed as I am at entanglements that remain in the way.)
(B) In either case, the pain itself is NOT the success where the point is to "finish the PROCESS" to resolve the cause of any "unnecessary conflict and pain."
If SP want to cause pain, as Socio did the other day, then to him that may be a successful completion of his goal. Whereas to me, success would mean resolving that issue by returning any money that was extorted so that NO ONE here is an accessory, accomplice, witness, victim or participant in any illegal act of extortion, blackmail or cyber bullying abuse. Especially NOT in any way connected with Luna or this forum which should seek to resolve and prevent such abuse.
In order to resolve the issue fully, this may cause "pain and disdain" to others in the meantime. Again, such pain is not the goal itself, but the unfortunate consequence of the ill acts to begin with which are equally complex to resolve.
I believe it is worth the effort to restore the integrity of the site and the members here equally concerned as I am.
If you aspire to equally high principles and goals, I would like to join forces with you and not be misperceived in conflict. Good day, Good Counselor. And my, you do look handsome in black. I would like to know the man underneath.
Pain to me feels good, so in many cases, it is success. 
In a more general sense, "no pain no gain", "nothing ventured, nothing gained", "nothing is gained without struggle", "every loss is a lesson", there's tons of quotes that support the idea that the harder you work, the more you get out of it, and hard work usually involves some form of pain, be it physical or mental. Things you are given are a treat, but things earned stick with you.
If neither of those touch upon what you meant, then I'm a bit lost.
by sLiMeYliMeYAbsolutely!
"Never stop because you feel defeated. The journey to the other side is only attainable after great suffering."
I think there is a specific term for "redemptive suffering" as above ^ (clearly opposed to self-induced suffering).
Struggle vs. Suffering:
I read a UU presentation that "suffering" in Buddhism was misinterpreted to sound like all physical life was inferior to spiritual life. Instead, "suffering in life" is closer to "Difficulty" or "Struggles" in life that are a natural process.
We all face "challenges" in life to grow as we overcome the fear or attachment to "conditions" we can't control.
Another misinterpreted word in religion is JIHAD which does not mean physical warfare, but more like a "Struggle for Peace". An "inner struggle" in the conscience to choose right and good over what is wrongful or ill will. So it is a spiritual war, but that is not the point. It is not to sacrifice others, but to discipline oneself, an inward struggle.
10
posts